Log in & Sign up
You are not logged in.
About last night ...
posted by Mike Boone at 22h52 EST on Dec 26
For the fourth straight game, the Canadiens gave up more than 40 shots.
They've won them all because of one player:
Jaroslav Halak.
Yes, he's had some breaks. Opponents have hit about six posts on this road trip. The very dangerous Phil Kessel had the winning goal on his stick and fired wide.
But man, this guy makes some stops.
Through four games of the road trip, Halak has faced a mind-blowing 186 shots. His 180 stops represent a sizzling 96.8 save percentage.
Halak is on fire. And until he cools off, Carey Price is going to sit.
There was a buzz for a while that the team played better in front of Halak than Price. But when you look at these crazy shot totals ...
Late in the third period, before AK46's improbable OT winner, Benoit Brunet said the Canadiens cannot continue to play the way they do. The RDS analyst said a "major adjustment" is in order.
This is a very ordinary – with gusts to bad – even-strength hockey team. The Canadiens are being carried by goaltending and special teams: another power-play goal last night, the PK was 4-4, including a 5-on-3.
But some of the stats were scary.
The territorial indicator, shots plus shots blocked plus misses, was 94-43 in favour of Toronto.
That's an ***-kicking.
Another indicator: Colton Orr went off four roughing seven minutes into the first period. It was Toronto's second and last penalty of the game.
That's how much pressure the Canadiens were able to exert: 53 minutes without an opponents' penalty.
And this was the Leafs, not the Penguins or Sabres or Devils or Hawks or Sharks or ...
The Canadiens are giving up 40-plus shots to fellow members of the Parity Division, average teams that will be biting and scratching for playoff spots into late March and early April.
Maybe it's unseemly to be doing this much whining after a W.
There were mitigating factors.
The Canadiens were finishing up a tough week. The NHL doesn't allow teams to travel on Christmas day, so they flew into Toronto Saturday morning. It was a long day, and the Canadiens looked tired during the latter part of the third period.
There were positive signs:
Scott Gomez continued his personal revival, scoring on the PP and assisting on the winner.
Tomas Plekanec scored and was solid, as always, on the PK.
Benoit Pouliot had four shots, four hits and continues to offer tantalizing glimpses of what is obviously a first-rate package of skills.
On a night when Andrei Markov wasn't great, Josh Gorges and Jaro Spacek stepped up. And Hal Gill was good on the PK. Ryan O'Byrne had a couple of hits and blocked shots.
But there wasn't much cohesion among the forwards. The top line struggled. Mike Cammalleri is 0-for-the trip and hasn't scored in the better part of two weeks. Pleks and his linemates had some very anxious defensive moments against Toronto's pluggers.
The 3Ms were outplayed, although Max Pacioretty skated hard and continues to develop into an interesting combination of speed and power.
Maxim Lapierre was 3-3, but the other centres got killed on draws.
If the NHL kept stats on one-on-one puck battles, this would be another embarrassment for the Canadiens.
But a W is a W.
The Canadiens are riding the league's longest winning streak. Their record on the road is better than they've played at the Bell Centre.
On to Ottawa, where Roman Hamrlik may be back while the Senators will be without daniel F. and Jason Spezza.
The consensus was the Canadiens needed eight ponts on their seven-game trip.
Done.
And Jaro Halak looks primed to steal some more.
Habs Inside/Out main RSS feed
"Chris, to segway back to a more productive discussion, I'd like your opinion on the Pleks contract you alluded to below. You're sure he'll test the waters. So what do you believe the difference in offers will be, Gainey versus what he could get elsewhere (reasonably get that is)? And what will it cost us to keep him (ie. what would e settle for to stay here)?"
Hey Punkster...sorry, didn't reply to this earlier as I was out of town visiting family this afternoon. Response is below...sorry if it's long.
As to what I think his value is, it comes down to comparables and what the market is looking like.
First up, based on a cap of roughly $55million (perhaps a touch lower), which was the most recent number I've heard bandied about, here are the teams that I could see making a play for Plekanec in the summer (salary cap numbers from nhlnumbers.com):
There might be other players, but that already extensive list are my best guesses at who might want a center. Some teams, such as St. Louis or Detroit, have a decent amount cap space but they have enough centers already. I have no idea if Phoenix will be a ward of the state, so I ruled them out of being active UFA players for next summer. If they are sold, they currently have the second most cap space in the NHL available for next year and need some good forwards.
With that many potential suitors, I could easily see the price ranging from $4.5-$6 million per year on a 4-7 year deal if Plekanec can continue to put up a point-per-game this season while leading the Habs excellent PK crew. Montreal could afford the low end of that scale, but the upper end would become painful as they've already got $30.5 M in salary cap on their books for 2010-11 for five players (Gomez, Gionta, Cammalleri, Markov and Hamrlik). I would be a bit surprised to see him get $6 M per season, as he has not consistently put up the kind of numbers as the guys (the Sedins, Gaborik, Hossa, Havlat) that received those contracts this past summer.
As you can see, I'm sitting on the fence...I really don't know what he'll get. But there are enough teams with a need for a two-way center that can offer lots of off-ice advantages and/or young, talented rosters that I could see his agent advising him to at least wait and take a look as to what is out there.
I don't believe that it is a done deal that he leaves Montreal if he is still un-signed as of July 1, as was the case for Komisarek, so I'm not that pessimistic on his situation. I just think he will be curious...Koivu often expressed curiousity about what his value would be on the open market, but he was always treated very, very well by Gainey and the organization and had no reason to be anything but completely loyal. I get the feeling with Plekanec that the trade rumous last season as well as the one-year contract offer soured him a bit on the concept of loyalty to the Montreal Canadiens. He's a good team guy, but he now knows that this is a business...he is 7 months away from a huge windfall if he plays his cards right, so I think the best thing for his career ambitions and his family is to explore that option thouroughly.
Thanks Chris. Got sidetracked and just now read your response. I think the item that stands out is in your assumption that the price could be "$4.5-$6 million per year on a 4-7 year deal". And that "he is 7 months away from a huge windfall". OK, so if the Habs are likely to only offer at the lower end of your assumption the only way Pleks may stay is if he decides to take the Koivu route; stay in the centre of the hockey universe and enjoy being the King of the home town heros. I don't see other teams offering longer term contracts for him given his history with the Habs (he's good but he hasn't been consistently dominant until this season). But this is all just speculation, a guessing game. Pleks is a pro and he'll likely make his decision by ranking the attributes and the first consideration will be money, no question. But those other intangibles may draw him back to Montreal, things like being a star in Montreal, family considerations, etc.
"OK, so if the Habs are likely to only offer at the lower end of your assumption the only way Pleks may stay is if he decides to take the Koivu route; stay in the centre of the hockey universe and enjoy being the King of the home town heros."
Yep, but the Habs never tried to trade Koivu. Nor did they avoid signing him to a longer term deal based on one miserable season (and Koivu had some nasty injury-ravaged years). So I just don't see him having the same loyalty that tied Koivu to Montreal.
"I don't see other teams offering longer term contracts for him given his history with the Habs (he's good but he hasn't been consistently dominant until this season)."
Hard to say...as I replied to Steve below, I sort of see Plekanec as a more offensively skilled and less defensively adept Mike Fisher, who was re-signed as a 27 year old by Ottawa to a 5 year, $4.2 M per year contract coming off a three year run where he averaged 22 goals and about 45 points per season. Like Plekanec, Fisher put up a stinker last season (13 goals and 32 points in 78 games) but is now being considered by many as a viable candidate for Canada's Olympic Team.
Even with Plekanec's stinker last season, he has averaged 23 goals and about 52 points per season over the past 3 years, numbers that will be pushed upwards by his excellent play this season. Those should merit at least a comparable deal to Fisher's, and in a market where Plekanec is one of the top UFA's available, a bidding war could easily drive the price upwards.
Another comparable to Plekanec is Andy McDonald in St. Louis. McDonald had a pair of big years with the Ducks post lockout, had a stinker year (for him) in 2007-08 before having a promising season derailed by a broken ankle last season. He's definitely more offensively gifted than Plekanec, but is also 6 years older and is a significantly less defensively aware player. With that in mind, he received a four year deal at $4.7 M per season.
Your last sentence kind of sums up my feelings; 4 years at $4.7 or thereabouts would be fair for Pleks in my mind. Yes, he can get more but is he worth more?. Better than Fisher but younger, less experienced than McDonald. Given the market 4@4.7 should be good. If Gainey were to match or slightly improve that I'd be happy but not much more than that. If Pleks still walks then, oh well, that's business. It will be interesting to see what happens and I'm going to save this guesstimate for future reference. By the way, good discussion. I'm learning:)
I pretty much agree...I wouldn't go much past $4.7 M either. But I'm curious to see if anybody else will.
McDonald got a "short" term because he was already 33...Plekanec I could see getting a 5 or 6 year deal if a team was trying to come in at the same dollar amount but willing to go higher in term. Gainey showed that he is okay with 5 year terms, even with a guy as old as 31, so I don't see the term being the deal-breaker in Montreal.
Chris - I'm not sure about LA seeing that they have Kopitar and Schenn at centre for the next few years. Then there is the Marleau-Jokinen-Pleks pinball situation. Calgary will need a 1st line centre for Iginla.
Hamrlik's contract should be enough to cover a raise for Markov and a lower end replacement for Hamrlik himself (in 2011). Subban and Weber would probably step in to replace Mara and Gill but that would really leave us with a small defense. No chance of a Cup with all those undersized guys on the back-end.
The other question is who replaces Pleks if we can't re-sign him? Gomez isn't a #1 centre and we don't have anyone in the system who seems capable of stepping in.
We're certainly going to see just what kind of GM Bob Gainey really is as he tries to stickhandle his way through this mess.
Schenn, as an 18 year old, is probably 3 or 4 years away from becoming a true top-6 center. And Kopitar is an excellent player, but he's playing too many minutes right now (21:36 per game)...Plekanec could ease the load a bit on him. Sign Plekanec to a decent-sized 4-5 year deal and you can bring Schenn along at a nicer pace, letting him shoulder top-6 minutes as a 22-23 year old, precisely when a guy like that usually hits his stride.
And if Schenn develops quicker, you can always trade Plekanec. I agree that it is far-fetched, but I think that the Kings are ahead of where people thought they would be...they might want to maximize their ability to contend a bit quicker before all that great young talent starts drifting away due to cap constraints down the road.
I agree with everything else you said. But we're not the only team in that boat...Gainey will have to start being more creative at finding talent, and the team will obviously have to start addressing their deficiencies via the draft, as opposed to always taking the best player available. That philosophy was necessary to build up a devastated farm system, but they now have some decent pieces in place. Now it is time to start building a contender.
Chris - I just double checked LA's salary grid and you may have a point. Handzus' contract is up next year so they could pick up some cap space there. Then there's the situation with Frolov. That situation would be worked out before they would try and sign Pleks.
I think all of us have to be careful right now seeing that Pleks is playing the best hockey of his life. Is this the new standard, or will be fall back a bit? Regardless, if we lose him, it could mean that we will have a gaping hole up front or will have to overpay for another guy who is a UFA. Nobody wants to hear it anymore, but the Gomez contract is screwing us over royally. Gainey panicked and now we are facing the reality of the situation.
I think that he will fall back a bit, but he has demonstrated that he is a Mike Fisher like guy capable of some good to very good seasons while always playing a hard-working, two way game.
His penalty killing prowess ranks him amongst the better players in the league in that regard, and Jordan Staal has parlayed his excellence as an elite two-way player into a $4 M average contract as an RFA. I don't think it is unfair to expect that as a UFA, Plekanec could pull in $4.5 M plus, depending on how he finished out the year. And regardless of his playmaking, you know what you're going to get from him in other aspects of his game...roughly 20 goals, durability and hard work.
At the begining of the year everyone talked about how this was a completely new team and we needed patience well who has been patient with this team?
Ok its almost halfway through the season but we have had more injuries than last year and to important players. This team is starting to gel and with the returns of some key players still out we could be a very good team. So give them time and stop trying to be gm's because I see what Gainey did and it will work out with time.
Although it's premature to do so...looking at the next couple of seasons can make a fan worry.
Worst case scenario in 10-11
lose pleks, metro and bergeron
Worst case sceneario in 11-12
lose markov & hamrlik
folks- understand that with even Gionta, Hamrlik and Mara coming back (which will make this Gainey experiment fully healthy for the first time all season) this team will go NOWHERE unless they add an elite shut down defenseman and a nasty big body on the wing to provide some space for our mini-habs!!!
W40 - That pretty well sums it up. Great post.
This team has had crazy amount of injuries all season long and when they come back we will finally have both markov and hammer in for the first time all season. Both log huge mins for us and guys like hall gill will be able to play a different role for the team. Thats what makes a team work each player contributing different skills. We havent been able to get everyone in their role so how can we see what this team can really do?
Gionta will add a great scorer to our second line which will give us 2 solid lines which can score and with a solid d this team can do some damage!
Everyone has to also understand that Halak is a good goalie but on certain plays creates a couple more easy shots for him to save with small rebounds. He is the same type of goalie as Tim Thomas or Hasek in that he creates extra work for himself which isnt a bad thing if he can stop those shots. But it increases the number of shots for the other team and makes the game look alot more lopsided.
Yeaa!!
After a year or more of trying, and registering under 3 different names, emailing Boone and getting transferred to a tech geek and being blown off by him, I'm finally able to register. Been reading here for awhile, and agree with some p[osts disagree with others- like most people here. Anyway- how is this for a theory- Since we all know price is a major head case would trading Halak improve his play? He would no longer be looking at the bench knowing if he screwed up Halak is in. When Huet was traded and he was #1 his play was great.
I feel your pain! I tried for awhile to register, only to get the "computer geek", who was no help. I guess he isn't paid to handle computer problems?
As for Price...indeed a major "head case". When has he EVER won anything for us. I guess his fans cling to that final play-off game against Boston. But they forget how the series got to 3-3. Then of course, came Philly...embarassing.
The media loves him..Why? Because he is a Canadian boy from the backwoods of B.C...Boosterism at it's worst, I say.
He doesn't show the skill set that other young goalies showed, before they went on to star in the league. What other #1 goalie constantly "ducks" when the puck is headed his way? No glove...no ability to follow the puck or anticipate the next pass...Trade him now.
His play was good for a while. Against the Flyers in the playoffs he almost singlehandedly cost us the series. He was very inconsistent last year as well. Now, when Price is having a very good year, Halak goes on a tear. I have no idea what they will do. I am a huge Halak fan, but Price could turn into something very special for a long, long time. If they have to trade one of them (Sanford would be a fine backup), maybe the trade deadline is the time - unless a very sweet offer lands on Gainey's lap. Make no mistake about it - Gainey is a Price man.
Agree- keep him as long as possible unless you can get a great eal like you say. Just throwing that idea out.
We're almost healthy.
How dissapointed are we all going to be when we get outplayed in the next 3 games and finish the road trip 7-0?
Go Habs Go!! "I can't hear what Jeremy (Roenick) is saying because my Stanley Cup rings are in my ears" - Patrick Roy
quit with the frivolous sarcasm...it's not helping anyone.
- let's make it a triple crown: Impacts, Alouettes and now the Canadiens!
Halak.
So is that the secret to The System? Give up as many shots as possible, get outplayed on any given night (by teams like Toronto or Atlanta), confused the crap out of the opposition by making them think we are bad (we are) and then SLAP them with some Jaro!!! Slap the crap out of them. Right in the face. JM is a genius. Bob is... whatever is better than a genius for hiring the coach who created The System.
About time you realized it! :D
before the game started that CBC ex GM quoted some amazing stat that did not favor visiting teams on Boxing Day. I can't remember the numbers. But I'm just going to take the win as it is. I'm not upset about the shots, just the one point we insist on giving the leaves each time we beat them. That can burn us later.
I thought that D'agastini played well with the time he was alotted. While Halak was the star without doubt, Markov continues to help. I believe that this was a loss without Him and his two assists.
Have a Merry Cammalleri and a Markov New Year!
Markov is good. Jaro was amaizing. How long will the Markov-Halak effect last though... i doubt very long if the rest of the stiffs play that way. Cammi was terrible last night. Totally invisible. I know he thinks that since he doesn't have the 8 mil/year contract all eyes are on Gomez but at 6 mil, Mikey, you should be working your tail off every single night too. I know, it sucks and unfair, but tis life.
I wouldn't include Pleks and AK46 in "the rest of the stiffs".
Then it's true. Santa didn't bring you a brain.
Wow... thanks. I don't think I can top that.
Too much turkey and stuffing and egg nog bogged down the team. That, and a same-day flight made them want the couch more than the ice last night.
___________________________________________________________________
This concludes our broadcast. Goodnight.
i think visiting teams don't play well on boxing day because the league doesn't allow teams to travel on christmas day. So teams have to travel on the day of their game.Look at last nights final results from the west.Six of the seven road teams from the west lost last night.
Great observation regarding Markov. We are probably 1-3 in our last 4 games without him. He makes a very big difference, even when he is not playing his best. Going to be great to see what we can do with him and the other wounded in the lineup together for 10-15 games.
Sould be right about the time I am in Montreal to see Pittsburg and Boston back-to-back. Can't wait.
Shots on goal.....well, has anyone considered the fact that we are ALWAYS killing penalties. If the other team has 2, 3, 4 more power plays than us, than we end up with alot of shots against and it also keeps us from attacking and getting more shots...As well, when the Leafs are allowed to clutch and grab and trip like the Bobby Baun era....well...it sure makes a difference in that department.
As for face-offs...losing them also puts us behind the 8-ball all the time.
New Year's Resolution for Bob Gainey.. Buy out Laracque....sit Gill, play Halak until he drops...Price, well we know he loves his "boy". But, if you don't have the reflexes, the ability to follow the puck, the glove, blah, blah, blah.....you won't get much better...
I dont know how long Laraque's contract is, but buying him out may also mean that there is some kind of cap hit that will affect us for a few years after the buyout
Gill has been ok, Mara will be sitting when he gets healthy enough if Hammer gets back.
Have a Merry Cammalleri and a Markov New Year!
Mara is better than Gill overall. Less giveaways and plays tougher. I hope O'Byrne stays in the lineup because he still needs time to develop and he crunches someone every game.
well time to play mise-O-jeu and bet on football games...
To all a late Merry Christmas....
Buy out Laraque and add $500K to the party.
Oh, but then there's the signing Price and/or Halak thing.
I don't think Pleks will accept that money right now, but who knows.
I have said it before and will again... Laraque is a nuclear deterent, nothing more.
Now, I know we all wish he was more than that, just like it would be great if our can openers could also double as automobiles. I know he does not fight much, but that's OK. He doesn't have to. And he plays it relatively smart. I liked the fact that he did not go after Orr last night. Orr took a penalty and why risk a fight that might energize the Leafs at a moment when we had the game well in hand (for much of the first period we did).
I don't care he is overpaid like I don't care Gomez is. I don't care he rarely plays. I don't care that when he does play I put a pillow over my eyes and sob gently into it until he gets off the ice. He is doing his job, seems like a good team guy and am happy to have in on the team until BG thinks otherwise.
Larague doesn't do much out there, if only he would dish out a big hit once in a while. That being said, he just has to skate into a scrum and the other team backs down. His reputation does the job for him. Yesterday was one of his better games.
I like your Nuclear Deterent description of BGL. We don't know what would happen if he wasn't dressed last night. We came out of that game with no new injuries. How much he had to do with that can never be defined.
Have a Merry Cammalleri and a Markov New Year!
Bob Gainey is a smart man. He will not trade Price. With Halak playing so well, if Bob is looking to deal him, and he is, he will get that much more for him. Last time Price sat he came back much stronger. He'll do the same this time too. Some team will be getting a great goalie with Halak.
you are 100% correct on the Fleury analogy, I said that a couple of weeks ago, I think we (Bob) have to keep our ears open and listen to any offer. I would prefer to move Halak if the right offer comes along or if we have to push for the right offer (Halak + players = top 3 forward or lottery pick). Since we'll make the playoffs we will draft in the middle as usual. We must take advantage of a hot commodity.
Agree that Price appears to have more upside. As for the situaiton, I say steady as she goes... the best course forward with these goalies will be clearer in a month or two if not longer. If there was urgency to do something with Halak earlier, it was solely based on his potential dissatisfaction with sitting. Now that he is playing well, I am sure that has subsided.
Gainey is a patient man... sometimes too patient but for all of us our greatest strength can be a weakness at times. Patience is a virtue when it comes to team development.
Combine it with Shiloh's "shots per game" post and my faith is restored in this blog. Like my golf game, 90 bad shots piss you off but the 2 or 3 good one's bring you back. Well played!
"Don't play to get into the Playoffs - Play to WIN the Division"
IT'S A TEAM GAME - Go Habs Go!
No goalie will be traded.
The 2 teams that need goalies the most (Philly and Atlanta) are in the chase against us for a playoff spot. So, unless they offer us something that we can't refuse - which I highly doubt - no one gets traded before the offseason. Or if by the trade deadline, we are sitting 5th or 14th, then we can trade...
Problem is, the offseason is when the trade value for Halak will go down tremendously, as teams in need of goalie help can be much more patient at that time.
People, forget about trading Price; unless we get a young franchise player back, this will not happen.
How about this, Price to Edm for their #1 this year??? Chance to get either Taylor or Tyler....
Since we love to gamble in Quebec, this is a good one..... Or Halak + 1 K brother or 2 for a #1...
Edmonton needs players and a goalie....
I would only trade for their #1 pick. The have The Wall to pay which screws them up... and some crazy salaries..
7 mil for Visnovsky ? then Markov is worth 10 mil....
alright so we learned the easiest lesson...hwo to win when we don't deserve it...now we have to learn the harder lesson...hwo to win and deserve it.
- let's make it a triple crown: Impacts, Alouettes and now the Canadiens!
Watching that game last night was like watching a pee wee game where checking is not allowed -- watching the Habs chase the puck instead of taking the body especially in their own end. We desperately need a D-Man that kicks butt. The Leafs skated our D in circles. Has Gill hit ANYONE this year?
"My face is my mask," Gump Worsley
Gill is totally hopeless, as is O'Byrne. There gotta be guys on the farm better than these two stiffs. Sadly, The GM won't give the farm boys a chance.
You haven't been watchin the pk closely enough. Gill is one of the reasons our penalty taking marathon hasen't hurt us the way it would without him!
Yea, and I appreciate his effort. but help us save us, the poor guy is SLOWER than SLOW.
Who on the farm brother? Let the Subban's and Weber's develop. Other than that, not much better available at this time? How's the weather?
Weather is great. No snow!!!
What part of Cape Breton are you from brother?
On the D thing, other teams bring their young guys up and let them develop under the gun. How about Doughty of LA, Myers with Buffalo, Shenn with Torronna. All good young players. I'm scared that Weber and Subban will end being life-long minor leaguers. And there's no way that they're worse than the two useless bozos I mentioned in my last post.
Born in North Sydney but grew up in Antigonish. Parents from Reserve and Glace Bay. Still lots of relatives in the Cape.
I know what you're saying but Myers and Doughty are exceptions. As the other post said, one of those if not both will be up next year to replace Mara to offset Plekanic's increase. Gill plays great on the PK. O'B? He's playing like last year since coming back after the injury. However why does Martin play him with MAB? And why ( I may be wrong) does Martin answer with the 4th line after the two goals plaving the latter two mentioned D on at least one of those times?
You make a good point North Sydney but it's not as if we have powerhouse like back in the old days when the young guys had to pay their dues.
The defense is just not good enough without both Markov and Hamerlik. Once both are healthy, the shots against should go down, and Hammers offence will help a lot. Lack of quality depth on defense is hurting.
Here's what Gui said about last night about being in Mtl and now in Minni...
"I didn't have a lot of ice time. I was a third-line or fourth-line player playing maybe 10 minutes a game. I was averaging 15 goals a year," he said. "Here I get the opportunity to play with some great players. I get a lot of ice time, so I'm happy to have the opportunity to produce."
aurghhhh, sometimes you kinda know how Charlie Brown feels after Lucy pulls the football away from him....
Good for him I guess.....
As I recall from his career here, Gui is great at first impressions. Let's wait a year or so to judge this trade. And if he turns it around good for him. I am OK with the evaluation that it wasn't likely to happen here.
Me too I kinda figured it wasn't going to work out here, but we have to ask why does it not work out here?
It becomes an organizational problem....
Gui was really the only player we could hope could become a true power forward. He had nobody to watch everyday to learn how it's done in the NHL. Minny has all sorts of these players. They are built for smash 'em up hockey, while we are built for speed (which Gui has none). The way I see it, he didn't really have a chance to thrive here without a power forward mentor or better foot speed.
-Dustin-
"The good thing about drinking during games is if they lose, you're too drunk to care during and too hungover to care after." - J.T.
Might not be an organizational problem... might be a player problem.
Might not be either... might be a timing problem. Sounded like Gui had quit on the team. It was not a good year to be doing that given the team spent the summer trying to root out dressing room issues. If Gui could have been demoted, I am sure that is what they would have done instead of trading him.
He's playing on change. He will return to his normal shi--y playing.
No he'll get his fair share of goals and play well.
$5 says he scores 15 or less for the year?
Gui doesn't bother me a bit. I don't think he'll ever be a top player, and I think that quote is b.s. He got some chances here but didn't cash in.
I'm NOT anti-Gui. In fact, relative, to the board here in general, I'm positively rosey. That said, he is not on my top 100 worry list. . . I was just trying to find a #5 below. I thought Higgins would hurt us more and that certainly hasn't happened. Think we have a little PTSD from trading away players in the 90's, but off the top of my head I can only think of Ribeiro and maybe Vokoun as someone we let go for nothing. The 90's. . . it was ridiculous how many we let go to other teams, which preceded our fall and remaining state of mediocrity.
I will say this, though, as someone who was very annoyed by his off-season moves. I wanted to keep Kovalev, was worried about losing Higgins as above, and thought the Gomez trade was a disaster. The third thing, notwithstanding his recent splurge, will always be a disaster because of his cap hit. All the other moves? Not one has hurt us. What HAS hurt us is tying up so much money that we can't sign anyone when they come free. That likely won't be Gainey's problem. . . whether he walks this summer or is made to walk.
I understand, what bugs me is the lack of player development. True BG has done very good moves when people expect the worst or expect nothing at all. But his big moves have for the most part gone nowhere. The lack of cap space will be a problem but next years team will pretty much look like this years team. The big question is where do you find the $$$$ for Pleks ????
Mara is gone after next year so that's 1.675, but you have to move someone to make some room, and BTW, Markov at 5.75 is a steal....he's a UFA after next year 2010-2011, so you figure he'll be worth at least 8 to 9 mil.... If Bob leaves whoever gets his job will better be a good acocuntant....
man that was ugly last night. trying to get it out of my mind.
here's my glass half-empty top five:
1. pleks not signed - not blaming anyone - and high likelihood of him leaving as a UFA
2. halak likely to be gone for little and will be an excellent performer elsewhere, which has been plainly obvious from his three year tenure here
3. cap problems will limit our flexibility to appreciably improve from our current very average plight for the next three to four years
4. jm's most predicted eventuality - a game of boring hockey in which we battle for 2-1 wins or losses - has not come to pass, and the team has become notable for its lack of work ethic again as was the case last season despite an entirely different group of players and a different coaching approach
5. latendresse appears to inexplicably be a 20-30 goal threat in the NHL, with his renaissance occuring immediately following his trade. . . where have we seen this before?
do i believe all of the above are fair? not entirely. it's just a feel-bad five off the top of my head in case any of you were feeling cocky. ;)
I remember that a lot of posters were laughing at me when I said that latendresse has more up side than Lapierre and it should be Martin's next project after he got AK going. Anyway, Pouliot has also good potential and the trade could work out.
Doug, you will have trouble erasing that game from your mind, seeing it was against the leafs. The really good memory will be Halak.
On your points:
1. Agreed - I too fear Pleks will leave. His stock has to be sky high right now. There were rumours that Burke wanted Savard next year, but since he's resigned, I'm sure he would love to get Plekanec.
2. Agreed, Halak will be good wherever he goes. He has proven himself.
3. Agreed - Cap problems will limit flexibilty. See your #'s 1 & 2.
4. Agreed - work ethic has suddenly disappeared. The most exciting thing about Habs' games lately has been watching Halak's play.
5. Latendresse has proven before that he can score goals, but is producing at a very high rate in Minny.
Points 1, 2 & 4 all relate to young players drafted by Montreal. We have let too many of them go already, & I hope that this does not happen to Plekanec & Halak. IMO your points are fair, & there may be a few cocky fans, but I feel most of us are watching the games with some fear & trepidation.
The positive thing is that the team is winning, & staying in the playoff race, & we still have Gionta, Hamrlik & Mara who will eventually return to the team.
I thought that up to about 3 days ago most people were praising this team for its work ethic. For the most part, this has been a group that has given its all and not given up, despite tough injuries. They did not give up last night. They did not play well, hung in and won.
I am a lot less concerned with shots on goal - they were playing a team last night that leads the league in shots on goal - than I am with losses.
Some Montreal fans aren't happy with a win when the game is not esthetically pleasing - it insults their refined sensibilities. Winning ugly is just fine for me as long as the team is trending up in the long-term - and this team is.
I agree with your last paragraph except I'm not sure we're trending up. I'm not saying we aren't, but missed a game in there from which to evaluate the "Markov era: 2009".
I agree they had tremendous work ethic in the first 25 games and it made the guys who were playing for all the injured players likeable. Recently they've seemed a little lazier is all.
Finally, I also agree that SOG don't matter that much. Case in point was Carolina - we dominated and it didn't matter that they were shooting to try to climb back in. Last night it was a horrible effort and the shots correlated better with the general imbalance in play. They sat on the lead. Whether told to one way or the other or not, that's what they did. Tie game and we showed up immediately. . . seems like an approach to having the lead that is Jerseyesque (and we tried it against them to) but inappropriate for our team's make-up in terms of personnel. Keep skating and keep working rather than trying to do whatever they were thinking they were doing last night.
Kudos to the Leafs as well... I know, that sounds terrible. But they are a desperate team right now and are on the verge of losing their season. We sat back a bit and they raised their game. They are slipping fast and last night represented a chance for them to spring-board into a very tough road trip with a win.
Did you see their bench at the end of the game. That Kostitsyn goal was a dagger right in the gut. If having them out shoot us badly only to lose it in OT like that hurts them this time as badly as it did the first time we did it, boy I will take it as hard as it is to watch.
leafs are nortorious for taking a lot of shots and still losing...jsut like we let a lot of shots and win
- let's make it a triple crown: Impacts, Alouettes and now the Canadiens!
Bob cant offer a new contract to Plekanec until Jan 1st (or even talk to his agent) because he signed a contract in 2009.
Patience.
I think if Plekanec is not greedy, he will sign before the end of the season. Else, we have to ship him out before the trade deadline, if the right offer comes along.
I know we can't sign him. That's why I don't assign a lot of blame. That said, Gainey should sh*t or get off the pot with our developing youth. Think you like them? Sign them longer for reasonable money (e.g., 2.75 x 3 years this past summer). We continually sign 9 disgruntled guys to a one year deal and that leaves them feeling either angry or unloved. Pleks may be a little bit less disgruntled because he got this money before heading to arbitration and is also a more reflective guy, but most hockey players take it personally.
As for the greed issue, I don't think we know that or could know that. It may be because he seems nice, etc., but I think his agent will attend to business and it's not like we offer a compelling place to play right now. What you see is what you get for the next few years - save for a big improvement when all players are finally on board in January. I also don't think looking for the best contract is greedy. . . I think it's common sense. Most guys have one opportunity to cash in and Pleks should take it. Another team might do the 8 year declining stuff for their Pleks. . . we will offer 4 years 4.5M and then shake our hands and pat him on the butt and tell him we're proud of him and he can always call home for advice. Tis the dignified thing to do, after all.
Out of all your points I think # 5 is the one that scares me the most....and scares a lot of people.
But it leads to 1 serious problem our player development. It has to be looked at. It doesn't make sense that we either over evaluate or under-evaluate players, we do good with near-end of line players (Metro, TK, Hammer etc) but our young players flounder... And then rise like a phoenix elsewhere.
It has to be addressed, image Lapierre ? If you are an NHL team I would love to trade for him at minimal value, which is about now, and see him pull a Gui....
It's very frustrating....
Geez, you'd think we lost or something. Gimme a break. I'm 85% negative and yet I loved last night's game. Guess I'm just in a good mood.
Leave the negativity out folks, we're on a 4 game win streak. Who cares if the Isles and Canes were part of it, just be happy we won games we SHOULD be winning.
The Price vs. Halak discussion is alive and well I see. Here's a thought for you all and remember that I like them both, equally. Do you think the fact that Halak is 2 years older than Price could be the reason he seems more confident? 2 years more experience and maturity at that age can make such a difference. Don't discount Halak as he is entering his best years as a goalie. And don't discount Price as he is still a few years from maturing. Just a thought (which, with 2 cups of strong coffee, can be dangerous on a Sunday morning).
Cliff notes version:
1. Halak two years older.
2. Don'd discount him because he's older.
3. Don't forget Price is younger.
Ok, Dave, here's my cliff-note post:
1. Gill is a foot taller than Gionta.
2. On the one hand, being taller increases your reach but can make you slower. On the other, Gionta is fleet of foot but can't check hard.
3. Don't discount the big, slow guy.
4. Don't overlook the small, fast guy.
:)
LOL...how true...or...every actor in this drama has a role to play and as long as they speak their lines we'll have a long run. Maybe no Tony Award but enjoyable evenings nonetheless.
That's why Price is the back-up he's shakey !
I've done some checking through past posts, and you seem to rarely appear after Price has turned in a great performance. What's your agenda? Is your real name Alan Walsh?
_____________________________________
Cheer for the crest on the front of the jersey, not the name on the back.
What about this scenario, with Halak playing so well right now and Silent Bob (who might be playing out his job here) would you trade Price knowing he will be 2 to 3 years away from being dominant. If the right offer comes along say a top 6 forward, say like a Bobby Ryan or so, would you trade Price for that player that will put you over the top ? We will not win the cup but might make it through 2 rounds....
Just wondering.
I went through a period of thinking that packaging Halak plus a couple of others (K brothers come to mind) would be to our advantage. But at this point I really don't think we should allow either goalie to walk. Individually they can dominate a game some nights (and stink up the joint every once in a while). But this is the type of young, talented tandem that will likely only get better and will likely make up for many shortcomings this team has now and in the future. I say "likely", maybe wishful thinking, but a solid goaltending duo would be something sweet to savour in the coming years as the team continues to bulid and grow. And bottom line, one single new top 6 forward wouldn't mean a hill of beans if we lost one of these two goalies.