Log in & Sign up
You are not logged in.
Ryder still looking for answers after bad season
posted by Kevin Mio at 16h58 EST on Aug 5
Tags:
Boone's Online Eeee-mail
Share the agony and ecstasy of Habs fandom and read live blogs from every game with Gazette columnist Mike Boone.
Fan Summit Info
The Puckcast
Weekly commentary and inside info about the Canadiens straight from the Gazette's experts.
Get the Flash Player to see this player.
The Rules
Habs Inside/Out encourages lively debate, but there is a zero-tolerance policy regarding racism, profanity and behaviour that we deem to be offensive. We will, without warning, ban those who do not abide by this simple rule, so as to maximize the enjoyment of readers and participants of both sexes and all ages.
Most Commented
Most commented posts from the last 7 days:
Habs Inside/Out main RSS feed
Mike Boone's RSS feed
PuckCast RSS feed
Site concept and design by User Generation
Resources
Player info:
League info:
Habs Inside/Out: Absolutely everything about the Montreal Canadiens
For editorial inquiries, contact Gazette sports editor Stu Cowan (scowan@thegazette.canwest.com).
For advertising inquiries, please contact your Gazette sales representative (gazadv@thegazette.canwest.com).
©2008 The Gazette, a division of Canwest Publishing Inc. All rights reserved. Unauthorized distribution, transmission or republication strictly prohibited.
T-Roy,
just saw your question earlier (i didn't get any messages from you)... Game in Edmonton and in Calgary sounds awesome. You have an in on how to get tickets to these games? Last time Habs were here there were no tickets and scalpers had a field trip selling them at about $400 a pop... brutal.
HABS SUMMIT 2008--Good news 87 requests for tickets, Bad news, we can only order 2 tickets per person max. Our maximum block that we can order is 56 tickets. For the people that want more than 2 they can purchase there extra tickets singularly on there own. And we will try to help you.
I will firm up the price to you in a day or so for your one or two tickets. All tickets will be paid for through PAY PAL, and I will explain how that is done probably tomorrow.
All tickets must be paid by noon Aug. 12th, or they will go to someone else.
Please stay tuned for the price and instructions how to pay in a day or so.
Thanks. Ian
Ian...just for some helpful information...it usually takes up to 7 business days for a deposit from a person's bank account to show up in a PayPal account. So if somebody is opening a PayPal account in order to purchase these tickets, they may need a little more time than the Aug. 12 deadline. Now, I don't know if you can get the funds into a PayPal account quicker by using a credit card, as I've never used one with PayPal.
Just a little heads up for those who are unfamiliar with PayPal and have asked for tickets.
Mike Boone is not a happy man this morning.
1. Posts on Michael Ryder - 227.
2. Posts on Chantal Machabée, who Boone adores - 67.
Mike wants to know what you people are thinking. :)
You're right.
I'm crushed.
Next time: Penelope Cruz.
Mike - Penelope has a new movie coming out which also stars Scarlett Johansson. That sure beats rehashing the Ryder soap opera.
The Original 24 Cups
I don't care what anyone says.
I have always really liked Ryder. He is a classy guy, one of the nicest guys on the habs last year to meet. He is still very much a small town boy.
He was at one time a hero on the habs, things didn't work out last year...
But I hope him all the best.
There is no reason to hate/boo him in my opinion.
Tomorrow Sidney Crosby will be 21 and considered a man so stop the whining .. Empty Netters ............ Here's a list of every player who averaged more than a point per game in more than 78 games before they turned 21.
Player, Team Games
Played Points Points
Per Game
1. Wayne Gretzky, Oilers 159 301 1.89
2. Mario Lemieux, Penguins 152 241 1.59
3. Sidney Crosby, Penguins 213 294 1.38
4. Eric Lindros, Flyers 126 172 1.37
5. Rob Brown, Penguins 119 159 1.34
6. Alex Ovechkin, Capitals 81 106 1.31
7. Dale Hawerchuk, Jets 239 296 1.24
7. Denis Savard, Blackhawks 156 194 1.24
9. Jimmy Carson, Kings/Oilers 240 286 1.19
10. Ron Francis, Whalers 210 241 1.15
11. Pierre Larouche, Penguins 155 179 1.15
12. Evgeni Malkin, Penguins 78 85 1.09
12. Barry Pederson, Bruins 89 97 1.09
12. Joe Sakic, Nordiques 150 164 1.09
15. Bryan Trottier, Islanders 156 167 1.07
16. Steve Yzerman, Red Wings 211 218 1.03
Lord knows how Rob Brown is on that list, let alone so high up on it. Other than, being on Mario Lemieux's line that is.
EMPTY
NM49 - Rob Brown - now there's a name from the past. He certainly had an offensive flair throughout his career (great junior player) but playing with Mario put him at #5 on your list. Kind of reminds me of Howe and Delvecchio. Every year they would get a new left winger who would instantly have a great season. As soon as the guy was taken off the line, his game would slide and he would go in the tank. You can bet that Satan has a big smile on his face these days. Marcus Naslund should have grabbed that gig but I guess that Pittsburgh was only offering a one year contract.
The Original 24 Cups
Haven't had much to say lately because there is nothing left to say about Ryder or the Sundin saga. I have, however, been reading everyday. Interesting comments on JT's blog about who will be the new target with Ryder gone. Some poor sucker, yet to be named, will bear the brunt of all that is wrong with our team for months to come. Fair enough I suppose. Such is the price to pay for making the big dollars. Good luck to Ryder. I'll even be OK if he pops a couple against us as long as les Habs prevail.
The Sundin thing has become hilarious. And really the man has done nothing wrong. I mean, consider the actions of that football player down south. Or all the greats who have retired and then come back. Seems to me that Mats is hoping to avoid that situation. Good luck to him also. Unless of course he's trying to beat our team.
GO HABS.
Logic!
I've found gold!
Nicely done everyone! I was just getting caught up and man... did the last few hours read well. Very entertaining. Nothing new was said, but boy, was nothing new said real swell like.
Before we get too upset about former Habs having success elsewhere and start having nightmareish flashbacks, let's keep things in perspective. Looking around right now we could lament the lose of: Beauchemin, Robidas, Rivet, Souray, Riberio(?), Ryder, Streit, Huet, Theodore(?), Garon, Tomas Vokoun, Arron Asham, Sergei Samsonov(?), Brian Smolinski, maybe a few others. Back in '97 we could look around and grind our teeth at the thought of the team we could construct with former Habs: Patrick Roy, Ron Tugnutt, Chris Chelios, Mathieu Schneider, Eric Desjardins, Lyle Odelein, Petr Svoboda, Jyrke Lumme, J.J. Daigneault, Craig Ludwig, John Leclair, Peirre Turgeon, Andrew Cassels, Russ Courtnall, Brian Bellows, Andrei Kovalenko, Guy Carboneau, Mike Keene, Claude Lemieux, Brian Skrudland, Donald Brashear, Jim Cambell, Craig Conroy. There were more, especially on defense but, I'll stop there. Check out the D on that team! I think the point is clear, we are a long way from where we once were in terms of giving up quality players. Let's enjoy the coming years, concentrating on the great players we have now.
Eric
Your point about the D-men brings back bad memories for me. I used to wonder if Serge Savard hated quality defensemen or if he was worried they might surpass his glory, if they stayed long enough. I seem to remember looking at one of my pool books in the late 90's and seeing 6 or 7, top four quality ex-Canadien's defensemen playing on other teams.
It was really weird wasn't it? Add to the fact that Laperriere was there and should have been able to give good feedback to Savard. Your theory is compelling and certainly tidily explains the mystery of why we kept Brisbois and lost Schneider and Desjardins, not to mention Chelios, Svboda, Lumme....
I read all the posts also and noticed abit of Lats bashing.I think a line we might see in training camp could be Lats, Chips and Max. I see this as a line that prosper together
There are very few players who stay with the same team through their playing days now,otherwise the bench would be an awfull lot bigger.
The trouble is as fans we take it personal when in fact it is a business.Good to see anyother fool up late...BC is exempt.
As so far as last year is concerned,thanks for nothing Micheal Ryder and as for this year with Ryder as a Bruin doing a Leclair on the Habs,just make him play against Laroque and watch Ryder disappear .GO HABS GO
My few cents from the peanut gallery:
(1) I always liked Michael Ryder. Anybody who can score regularly against the Maple Leafs is a player in my books. I'll never forget his performances in some of the games against Toronto.
(2) I don't ever recall him bitching or moaning about not playing. Certainly not like other players have in the past based on my recollection (Grabovski, Dandenault). So despite Carbonneau putting him on the bench he still didn't moan to the press. I give him credit for that.
(3) He bears responsibility for not producing last season. That is the price when you are a millionaire paid to play the game of hockey. However, it's also fair to state his regular linemates (Koivu, Higgins) didn't have terrific seasons and were slow out of the gates last year. You cannot say that did not have an impact on him or wasn't a contributory factor.
(4) Bob Gainey could have traded him at the deadline. But I recall at the time that Ryder had scored 2 goals in a game and was starting to appear to be coming around. I can't blame Gainey for holding on to him as they wanted to make a deep run into the playoffs. The same thing happened with Souray where he could have dealt him but did not. We all have the benefit of hindsight after the fact to look like Sam Pollock.
(5) Ryder strikes me as a decent guy who hails from a small town. I hope he gets his career back on track but not at the expense of our team. One John Leclair is more than enough during my lifetime. And despite being someone from the East Coast originally, I still hate the Bruins. With or without Ryder on their team. That will never change.
I do not wish to dispute a single point that you have made here, as they are as valid and sensible as they are crystal clear.
However, on one point, I wish to add that there is a flipside to the coin.
In regards to a player accepting his benching fate quietly and in a sportsmanlike manner, that may not quite be the reaction a coach has sought when omitting a player from the lineup.
While it is commendable to accept things in a respectable way, the mental side of the game of hockey - an aggresive and sometimes even violent sport - perhaps requires an entirely different response.
Speaking from the POV of a former coach myself, I often involved players in subtle mind games as a way to gauge their character. If I simply sat a player during the third period of a game, and he did not balk, I immediately understood that he was not going to be a player I wanted on the ice at that crucial time of the game.
With that type of thinking in mind, if I were to have been an NHL coach, the reaction I would have hoped for from a player cast aside would have been absolute anger.
I would wish for that player to kick over trash cans, spout off, bitch, complain, and hence challenge the decision and prove it wrong.
Show some character, some defiance, and some pride.
If after the third or fourth benching, these traits have yet to be revealed, I would honestly begin to wonder if in fact the player cared at all.
As a coach, you want to elicit some form of resolve from the player. You want to see his frustration boil over into a passionate reaction that translates itself onto the ice.
If, in the end, all you get are the paper planes of indifference and nonchalance, you begin to understand that the player is not a keeper.
I think the coach will put the spin that he wishes depending on his opinion/feelings of the player. If he takes the benching in stride, they might praise him for being a team player, and if he doesnt, then they may label him selfish or a troublemaker. I think if a coach wants a rise out of a player, hed probably bench him on the bench not in the stands.
Robert L. - After seeing what happened when Rivet balked when benched a player may just act in the opposite way and think that's the way to go. The president was set with Samsonov and Rivet with the coach so don't rock the boat. Your damned if you do and your damned if you don't. So if your into mind games then use them on everybody rather than a few and for me i couldn't care less what the player was doing in the stands , to a point , as long as when he was on the ice he preformed his duty at 100% and i think you would of had a problem coaching Doug Harvey and Jacques Plante , lol.
The Rivet and Samsonov cases differ, Bryan.
Rivet's was a dressing room clique / media leak that needed to be undone.
Samsonov pouted before he produced.
In this day and age, it's foolish to treat all players on the same level because ego's, just to single out one facet, are too individualistic.
In regards to Harvey and Plante in the early 1960's, the mind games went both ways.
Doug was injustly crucified for trying to start a players union. As he was a free spirit who tended to defy authority at every turn, he was sacrificed.
Jake the Snake, for Toe Blake, was a flake!
A coach needed a concrete assessment of a starting goalie's state of mind when putting forth a game plan. With Plante at that time, Blake never could have any peace in knowing where his stopper stood.
All in all, the era's were different, and Bryan, you could tell me way more about that, than what I have read and learned. But as far as today's player's go, I still feel that each individual represents a separate scenario.
Every team has their cliques and if media leak was the reason for his departure why did it take the Habs so long to get rid of Desjardin , Brisbois and Nilan as they were more than leaks. Besides that has nothing to do with you saying that Ryder didn't care. I used Rivet and Samsonov as examples of the benching issue and how they reacted. If your working in an office , a construction site or a hockey team there isn't a big difference how people react to situations especially if the scene has happened before. If it went bad your not going to follow in the footsteps of your predecessors so you act differently as Ryder did. Anyway i have been fortunate enough to work in the out ports of NL and Gaspe amd small town Cape Breton and the nature of the people is entirely different in general from city folks and those people don't get excited over many things so if your a coach you should be aware of that relaxed attitude and it still exists in my friends children out there. That said , it doesn't mean that the job doesn't get done , it's just another way of dealing with things , lots of time , me son. Catch you later , Robert.
You amaze me Robert;historian,economist and now a shrink.You must have been doing some research on Bowman at the time.Yeah ,went to lala land but some a**h**e called and woke me up.By the way 1) when is year 3 coming out and 2) publishing houses employee high powered lawyers .Still would love to see your work published.
HabFab - I'm no shrink or economist, and I am working on the historian bit every day!
Long before I even began to understand anything Scotty Bowman did with the Habs, I understood that coaching in part is a management of different personalities.
1911-12 will be on site later today.
As far as being published in any way, that is a sweet dream, but presently my goal is simply to translate what I have learned to my fellow fans.
I don't quite have the vocabulary to become an author of any sort, but your compliment is taken to heart.
A big thanks and be well to you!
Divine, just divine. Number 5 is as true as it gets.
"Oh come all ye faithful"
Since Michael Ryder was a Hab, I've probably missed a handful of games that he has played for the Canadiens. I have a decent memory and I seem to recall him scoring many big goals for the Habs, prior to last season. Someone posted that he only scored garbage goals and basically padded his stats when the Habs were either head by a lot or behind by a lot. Not how I remember it, so I looked to the 2006/2007 season
Ryder scored 30 goals for the Habs
20 of then either tied the game or put Montreal ahead(team leader)
6 goals were the first goal of the game(team leader)
3 goals were the game winning goal
7 goals either tied the game or put the team ahead in the 3rd period
4 goals were score with the team ahead by one goal
2 goals were scored with the team behind by two goals
Not counted in the above were four goals, that I consider big goals
-Trailing Buffalo 4-1, he scored to make it 4-2, Habs tied it 4-4 but ended up losing 6-4
-Trailing Rangers early in 2nd 2-0, Ryder scores and habs end up winning 6-5
-Trailing 3-0 to Sabres, Ryder scores, Habs go into third down 5-4, lose 8-5
-Trailing Toronto 3-1, Ryder scores first goal of natural Hat Trick, Habs surge to 4-3 lead.
By my count that is 24 of 30 goals that I would consider Big/Important goals.
Really, though it is time to move on. He is in Boston, I hope he does well and the Bruins lose every game they play.
p.s. I might be out a goal here or there but it is close enough to make my point. It was done fairly quickly
ebk - Point very well made once again.
Good post.
Post new comment